Áudio Analógico de Portugal
Bem vindo / Welcome / Willkommen / Bienvenu

Áudio Analógico de Portugal

A paixão pelo Áudio


Fórum para a preservação e divulgação do áudio analógico, e não só...
 
InícioPortalCalendárioPublicaçõesFAQGruposRegistrar-seConectar-se
Fórum para a preservação e divulgação do áudio analógico, e não só...

Compartilhe | 
 

 Tribunal das escutas!

Ir em baixo 
Ir à página : Anterior  1, 2, 3, 4  Seguinte
AutorMensagem
radamel
Membro AAP


Mensagens : 67
Data de inscrição : 06/09/2018

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 20 2018, 20:25

Sempre considerei muito importante a questão do Timing/ precisão temporal na reprodução de música gravada.

Quando há essa precisão tudo me parece bem mais realista.
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qua Nov 21 2018, 15:05

Goansipife escreveu:
É claro que estamos, Ricardo! Então os equipamentos de áudio servem para quê? Não é para reproduzirem música? ...

ricardo onga-ku escreveu:
... O equipamento oferece-nos (reproduz) aquilo que está gravado com maior ou menor fidelidade.

As ressonâncias da sala podem produzir um efeito subjectivo que podemos descrever como um arrastar do grave...

Voçês estão ambos a falar da mesma coisa, mas em sentidos diferentes e ambos téem razão!...

O Gonçalo falou de um método que permite de identificar à escuta a justa reprodução da rapidez ...

O Ricardo està a procurar razões técnicas que possam justificar uma mà reprodução da rapidez ...

Estão então ambos na Ponte 25 de Abril ... mas um do lado de Lisboa e o outro do lado de Almada!... lol!

Abraço aos dois cheers

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
ricardo onga-ku
Membro AAP
ricardo onga-ku

Mensagens : 5342
Data de inscrição : 02/01/2012
Localização : Terra d'Anglos...e Saxões

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qua Nov 21 2018, 22:09

TD124 escreveu:
Goansipife escreveu:
É claro que estamos, Ricardo! Então os equipamentos de áudio servem para quê? Não é para reproduzirem música? ...

ricardo onga-ku escreveu:
... O equipamento oferece-nos (reproduz) aquilo que está gravado com maior ou menor fidelidade.

As ressonâncias da sala podem produzir um efeito subjectivo que podemos descrever como um arrastar do grave...

Voçês estão ambos a falar da mesma coisa, mas em sentidos diferentes e ambos téem razão!...

O Gonçalo falou de um método que permite de identificar à escuta a justa reprodução da rapidez ...

O Ricardo està a procurar razões técnicas que possam justificar uma mà reprodução da rapidez ...

Estão então ambos na Ponte 25 de Abril ... mas um do lado de Lisboa e o outro do lado de Almada!... lol!

Abraço aos dois cheers

E ao que parece estamos encravados no trânsito...
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Nov 24 2018, 11:00

Had a grounding experience...

Ad a hifi shop I listened to Beyerdynamic DT1990 Pro, Amiron Home and T1 2nd Gen.
System was a BlueNode streamer and Simaudio Moon 230 HAD (DAC/canamp)

All three are very good headphones but coming home I could appreciate the Henry, enFase and DT880 a lot more than before.

And even the ifi iDSD nano with ATH-R70x for recreational listening.

Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Nov 24 2018, 12:04

mannitheear escreveu:
... Ad a hifi shop I listened to Beyerdynamic DT1990 Pro, Amiron Home and T1 2nd Gen.
System was a BlueNode streamer and Simaudio Moon 230 HAD (DAC/canamp)

All three are very good headphones but coming home I could appreciate the Henry, enFase and DT880 a lot more than before. ...

Indeed its a grounding experience ... and a very strange one. If the prices are in Germay as in France, you've heard a CanSystem 3 times more expensive than yours, and as a result you appreciate even more now your system!...

Everybody as the right of a fair trial ... so explain us why you haven't bought one of these Beyer's gems !!!

Biz man cheers

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Nov 24 2018, 16:56

TD124 escreveu:
mannitheear escreveu:
... Ad a hifi shop I listened to Beyerdynamic DT1990 Pro, Amiron Home and T1 2nd Gen.
System was a BlueNode streamer and Simaudio Moon 230 HAD (DAC/canamp)

All three are very good headphones but coming home I could appreciate the Henry, enFase and DT880 a lot more than before. ...

Indeed its a grounding experience ... and a very strange one. If the prices are in Germay as in France, you've heard a CanSystem 3 times more expensive than yours, and as a result you appreciate even more now your system!...

Everybody as the right of a fair trial ... so explain us why you haven't bought one of these Beyer's gems !!!

Biz man cheers

I did not want to make a trial here and wrote about that experience only in the context of looking for a "better" can than the DT880 where the K812 failed very much which is not the case with the DT1990 or T1.

The prices have dropped and the 880 is 200, the DT1990 430, Amiron home 530 and the T1 760 (Moon 230 HAD amp/DAC 1550).

But the overall sound was thicker and coarser as I'm used to and lacked a bit attack, air and elegance, so it took bit until I got used to it. Oddly I felt sometimes a tiny bit bass distortion on some rock tracks which seemed not related to the cans.
All three cans are close to neutral but with more body and bass than the 880, the T1 is somewhere between 880 and Amiron/1990. The Amiron sounded to me a bit too relaxed and vague so I sorted it out first.
The 1990 has plenty of bass and the T1 more elegance and a more airy and 3-dimensional sound but what distracted me was that the treble seemed a bit artificial emphasized.
Of course I should listen to the T1 and the 1990 at home to get a better picture but I feel that the improvement will be only gradually...

Biz Paulo!
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Nov 24 2018, 18:06

mannitheear escreveu:
... I did not want to make a trial here ...

It was a joke ... cos "tribunal" is the name of the thread lol!

Biz Man

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 11:29

mannitheear escreveu:
... All three cans are close to neutral but with more body and bass than the 880, the T1 is somewhere between 880 and Amiron/1990. The Amiron sounded to me a bit too relaxed and vague so I sorted it out first.
The 1990 has plenty of bass and the T1 more elegance and a more airy and 3-dimensional sound but what distracted me was that the treble seemed a bit artificial emphasized.
Of course I should listen to the T1 and the 1990 at home to get a better picture but I feel that the improvement will be only gradually...

I suppose that except the T1(600 ohms) the other had an impedance of 250 ohms. This seems vey interesting to me cos i'm thinking about a "big version" of the enFase. The can's were "burned" already?... cos from my experience its very important and may change a lot the listening. If the T1 gen 2 has more elegance this can be a good choice for me to ear scratch Indeed the actual price is very interesting and Christmas arrives Cool

Biz Man

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
reirato
Membro AAP
reirato

Mensagens : 3187
Data de inscrição : 08/11/2010
Idade : 74
Localização : Stª Maria de Belém, Lisboa

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 12:19

TD124 escreveu:
mannitheear escreveu:
... All three cans are close to neutral but with more body and bass than the 880, the T1 is somewhere between 880 and Amiron/1990. The Amiron sounded to me a bit too relaxed and vague so I sorted it out first.
The 1990 has plenty of bass and the T1 more elegance and a more airy and 3-dimensional sound but what distracted me was that the treble seemed a bit artificial emphasized.
Of course I should listen to the T1 and the 1990 at home to get a better picture but I feel that the improvement will be only gradually...

I suppose that except the T1(600 ohms) the other had an impedance of 250 ohms. This seems vey interesting to me cos i'm thinking about a "big version" of the enFase. The can's were "burned" already?... cos from my experience its very important and may change a lot the listening. If the T1 gen 2 has more elegance this can be a good choice for me to ear scratch    Indeed the actual price is very interesting and Christmas arrives  Cool

Biz Man

Hi

Which one of the three to buy for an original canamp ICON Audio, Mk I use?...


king
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
http://arato.rocha@gmail.com
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 13:16

reirato escreveu:

Hi

Which one of the three to buy for an original canamp ICON Audio, Mk I use?...


king

Hi Reirato,

I'm very sorry but I really don't know because I don't know the Icon Amp and only have a first impression of the 3 cans. My feeling is, that the DT1990 is a terrific can for the current price but I'm absolutely not sure what to think about the T1.
The Amiron was not exactly my cup of tea, even though they lie close together. For relaxed listening my choice is the Audio Technica ATH-R70x...
cheers
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 13:23

TD124 escreveu:

I suppose that except the T1(600 ohms) the other had an impedance of 250 ohms. This seems vey interesting to me cos i'm thinking about a "big version" of the enFase. The can's were "burned" already?... cos from my experience its very important and may change a lot the listening. If the T1 gen 2 has more elegance this can be a good choice for me to ear scratch    Indeed the actual price is very interesting and Christmas arrives  Cool

Biz Man

Hi Paulo,

The cans were demo-models so I suspect they had just some hours on it. Afaik the T1 is 600 Ohm and DT1990/Amiron 250 Ohm, as you said.

I don't know yet what to think about the T1...I don't get them out of my mind, so I think I'll getting into one of them, too.

But the last thing I would wish is a a "big version" of the enFase - alone thinking about it scares me.  dvil

Biz!
Manfred
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 20:16

mannitheear escreveu:
... I don't know yet what to think about the T1...I don't get them out of my mind, so I think I'll getting into one of them, too.

But the last thing I would wish is a a "big version" of the enFase...

You can't make a listening with enFase to see if the differences remain the same or if something changes ?

At the opposite ... i feel myself ver excited with the idea of a BIG version bounce

lol!

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 20:34

TD124 escreveu:

You can't make a listening with enFase to see if the differences remain the same or if something changes ?

I will, but don't know how and when... have written to Beyerdynamic. The dealer is not very cooperative...

At the opposite ... i feel myself ver excited with the idea of a BIG version bounce

Pleas help me out: I have no idea what a BIG version would do better????  sunny

lol!
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 21:11

mannitheear escreveu:
TD124 escreveu:

You can't make a listening with enFase to see if the differences remain the same or if something changes ?

I will, but don't know how and when... have written to Beyerdynamic. The dealer is not very cooperative...

There are that kind of dealers in Germany also  confused  ... you can't pick the enFase to listen on the shop either ???

How it is possible to listen and choose the right can ... if isn't tested with your gear ? Suspect

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
Alexandre Vieira
Membro AAP
Alexandre Vieira

Mensagens : 4672
Data de inscrição : 11/01/2013
Idade : 49
Localização : The Other Band

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 22:50

TD124 escreveu:
Goansipife escreveu:
É claro que estamos, Ricardo! Então os equipamentos de áudio servem para quê? Não é para reproduzirem música? ...

ricardo onga-ku escreveu:
... O equipamento oferece-nos (reproduz) aquilo que está gravado com maior ou menor fidelidade.

As ressonâncias da sala podem produzir um efeito subjectivo que podemos descrever como um arrastar do grave...

Voçês estão ambos a falar da mesma coisa, mas em sentidos diferentes e ambos téem razão!...

O Gonçalo falou de um método que permite de identificar à escuta a justa reprodução da rapidez ...

O Ricardo està a procurar razões técnicas que possam justificar uma mà reprodução da rapidez ...

Estão então ambos na Ponte 25 de Abril ... mas um do lado de Lisboa e o outro do lado de Almada!... lol!

Abraço aos dois cheers


Estaremos perante o Complexo de Édipo ou de Electra?
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
Alexandre Vieira
Membro AAP
Alexandre Vieira

Mensagens : 4672
Data de inscrição : 11/01/2013
Idade : 49
Localização : The Other Band

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Nov 27 2018, 23:46

In this topic stopped talking about hi end / low end, and talks about expensive end and cheap end
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
reirato
Membro AAP
reirato

Mensagens : 3187
Data de inscrição : 08/11/2010
Idade : 74
Localização : Stª Maria de Belém, Lisboa

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qua Nov 28 2018, 00:40

E ao Tribunal é(são) levadas a juízo estas colunas, melhor dizendo altifalantes...





E  o Galego  Juan Portela Seijo  também vai a juízo, como autor!
https://gciencia.apercloud.es/historias-gc/juan-portela-seijo-organ-sound/

Indiciados do nefando delito de apresentarem um dos "melhores altifalantes do mundo"!??...

Que terá a acordar o ilustre Jurí residente  AAP?

Que se faça justiça!! Rolling Eyes

king
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
http://arato.rocha@gmail.com
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qua Nov 28 2018, 07:13

Alexandre Vieira escreveu:
In this topic stopped talking about hi end / low end, and talks about expensive end and cheap end

I guess this is discussed in the other topic...
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qua Nov 28 2018, 09:36

TD124 escreveu:

I suppose that except the T1(600 ohms) the other had an impedance of 250 ohms. This seems vey interesting to me cos i'm thinking about a "big version" of the enFase. The can's were "burned" already?... cos from my experience its very important and may change a lot the listening. If the T1 gen 2 has more elegance this can be a good choice for me to ear scratch    Indeed the actual price is very interesting and Christmas arrives  Cool

Biz Man

reirato escreveu:

Hi

Which one of the three to buy for an original canamp ICON Audio, Mk I use?...


king

Here a topic in french over 41 pages (!) about DT 1990, T1 and comparisons to others like HD600, HD660, Focal Elear and Clear...
http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/casques-sedentaires/beyerdynamic-dt-1990-pro-amiron-home-dt-990-pro-t1-t30077097.html
cheers
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qua Nov 28 2018, 09:54

mannitheear escreveu:
... Pleas help me out: I have no idea what a BIG version would do better????  sunny  

Well, many years ago a Pat's friend (Jeff), stucked on my first CanAmp (Solitaire) but like many people he wasn't able to get one, since it was a limited edition and only five have been made. He wasn't really sad at the time, since like many people he prefered the room listening. But 10 years ago he had twins and his life changed a lot ... he became a "can maniac" worst than i and actually he have a lot of cans and listen "almost" like that!...

He and Pat ask me (with insistence) for some time ago to do a big version of Solitaire ... and i start thinking about it! Jeff have one enFase since six months and he is completely happy and surprised, since he had four bigger CanAmps that he is selling now Wink . They want a bigger version with symetric outputs, tube rolling, impedance switch and integrated Dac ... and that means really a big Solitaire on the technical idea!

So to reply you, idon't know!!! Infortunately and its my only regret since i produce gear, i haven't kept one Solitaire for myself and all are abroad on studios (there's only one in a marseille studio). In my "souvenir" Solitaire was "darker" than enFase but sculptural, powerfull and very dynamic! At the beginning of the 2000's the cans weren't on the move like today, but Hiraga found him (with his MDR-R10 King) the best canamp he have heard ... and i found the King the best can i've heard ... but a love story between King and Solitaire have been created, i think Wink

So i'm thinking that if i can add the sculptural and majestic sound of the Solitaire with the transparence and speed of enFase ... i'll get what may be my last canamp, so the idea are invading me and grows each day creating a great excitement !!!

Voilà Man cheers

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qua Nov 28 2018, 12:42

TD124 escreveu:

Well, many years ago a Pat's friend (Jeff), stucked on my first CanAmp (Solitaire) but like many people he wasn't able to get one, since it was a limited edition and only five have been made. He wasn't really sad at the time, since like many people he prefered the room listening. But 10 years ago he had twins and his life changed a lot ... he became a "can maniac" worst than i and actually he have a lot of cans and listen "almost" like that!...

He and Pat ask me (with insistence) for some time ago to do a big version of Solitaire ... and i start thinking about it! Jeff have one enFase since six months and he is completely happy and surprised, since he had four bigger CanAmps that he is selling now Wink . They want a bigger version with symetric outputs, tube rolling, impedance switch and integrated Dac ... and that means really a big Solitaire on the technical idea!

So to reply you, idon't know!!! Infortunately and its my only regret since i produce gear, i haven't kept one Solitaire for myself and all are abroad on studios (there's only one in a marseille studio). In my "souvenir" Solitaire was "darker" than enFase but sculptural, powerfull and very dynamic! At the beginning of the 2000's the cans weren't on the move like today, but Hiraga found him (with his MDR-R10 King) the best canamp he have heard ... and i found the King the best can i've heard ... but a love story between King and Solitaire have been created, i think Wink

So i'm thinking that if i can add the sculptural and majestic sound of the Solitaire with the transparence and speed of enFase ... i'll get what may be my last canamp, so the idea are invading me and grows each day creating a great excitement !!!

Voilà Man cheers

Hi Paulo,

great story! I would agree to symmetric outputs (still have my doubts if it's really necessary) and  impedance switch but I'm glad that enfase does not support "tube rolling" and an integrated DAC is redundant imho.
Do you think of a "universal" canamp or of one which is tailored for one designated headphone?

Biz to all!
Manfred
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qui Nov 29 2018, 11:17

reirato escreveu:
E ao Tribunal é(são) levadas a juízo estas colunas, melhor dizendo altifalantes...





E  o Galego  Juan Portela Seijo  também vai a juízo, como autor!
https://gciencia.apercloud.es/historias-gc/juan-portela-seijo-organ-sound/

Indiciados do nefando delito de apresentarem um dos "melhores altifalantes do mundo"!??...

Que terá a acordar o ilustre Jurí residente  AAP?

Que se faça justiça!! Rolling Eyes

king

Crazy thing! Did anyone listen to them???
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qui Nov 29 2018, 11:21

TD124 escreveu:
[

You can't make a listening with enFase to see if the differences remain the same or if something changes ?

T1 2ndGen is on it's way to the court... affraid
 

When will the antiDac be ready for full justice? bounce

cheers
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
Alexandre Vieira
Membro AAP
Alexandre Vieira

Mensagens : 4672
Data de inscrição : 11/01/2013
Idade : 49
Localização : The Other Band

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qui Nov 29 2018, 11:25

mannitheear escreveu:
Alexandre Vieira escreveu:
In this topic stopped talking about hi end / low end, and talks about expensive end and cheap end

I guess this is discussed in the other topic...


Do you see any difference?


smedley
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qui Nov 29 2018, 13:29

Alexandre Vieira escreveu:

 Do you see any difference?
smedley

Oh yes, here is the place to listen end tell if a device is good or not, no matter if it's cheap or expensive!

cheers

Waiting for more listeing experiences!!!

bounce
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
galvaorod
Membro AAP
galvaorod

Mensagens : 431
Data de inscrição : 14/04/2017

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qui Nov 29 2018, 15:11

mannitheear escreveu:
reirato escreveu:
E ao Tribunal é(são) levadas a juízo estas colunas, melhor dizendo altifalantes...





E  o Galego  Juan Portela Seijo  também vai a juízo, como autor!
https://gciencia.apercloud.es/historias-gc/juan-portela-seijo-organ-sound/

Indiciados do nefando delito de apresentarem um dos "melhores altifalantes do mundo"!??...

Que terá a acordar o ilustre Jurí residente  AAP?

Que se faça justiça!! Rolling Eyes

king


Crazy thing! Did anyone listen to them???

Foram feitas pelo Sandokan?
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
reirato
Membro AAP
reirato

Mensagens : 3187
Data de inscrição : 08/11/2010
Idade : 74
Localização : Stª Maria de Belém, Lisboa

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qui Nov 29 2018, 17:35

mannitheear escreveu:
reirato escreveu:
E ao Tribunal é(são) levadas a juízo estas colunas, melhor dizendo altifalantes...





E  o Galego  Juan Portela Seijo  também vai a juízo, como autor!
https://gciencia.apercloud.es/historias-gc/juan-portela-seijo-organ-sound/

Indiciados do nefando delito de apresentarem um dos "melhores altifalantes do mundo"!??...

Que terá a acordar o ilustre Jurí residente  AAP?

Que se faça justiça!! Rolling Eyes

king

Crazy thing! Did anyone listen to them???

Absolutely!!,,,
Refer to:   https://gciencia.apercloud.es/historias-gc/juan-portela-seijo-organ-sound/
Please note the blue one that in fact was the original artifact, built in 1942 and the other, the white one was replicated in 2017 by inventor´s  followers ( son and associates ).

They are said to reproduce at a domestic scale the sound of the Pipe Organ of the Cathedral of Santiago (Compostela, Galicia )!?....

.

Here one could find a reason to justify  a pilgrimage to Santiago de Compostela to see the Light of the Apostol and hear the wonders of the tubes!?...

king
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
http://arato.rocha@gmail.com
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qui Nov 29 2018, 18:00

mannitheear escreveu:
... T1 2ndGen is on it's way to the court...  affraid

When will the antiDac be ready for full justice? bounce ...

That's a good news!... the antidac leaves tomorrow or after tomorrow, i'll send you a mail.

It was hard to get what i wanted sonically, but now its ok !!!

Biz cheers

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
Pmoura43
Membro AAP
Pmoura43

Mensagens : 488
Data de inscrição : 25/03/2012
Idade : 51
Localização : São Martinho do Porto

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Qui Nov 29 2018, 21:42

TD124 escreveu:
mannitheear escreveu:
... T1 2ndGen is on it's way to the court...  affraid

When will the antiDac be ready for full justice? bounce ...

That's a good news!... the antidac leaves tomorrow or after tomorrow, i'll send you a mail.

It was hard to get what i wanted sonically, but now its ok !!!

Biz cheers




Aguardo
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sex Nov 30 2018, 09:24

Speaking of low prices:

Big surprise yesterday! In the lunch break I visited a friend to pick up some fresh coffee beans and drink the best espresso in town. Then he showed me a Stax Set he just got but doesn't need. He offered me to test at home and buy it for a very low price, if I liked it.

It's a Stax SR Lambda with SRD-7 SB passive transformer box to generate the high voltage needed for the electrotatic drivers. The SRD-7 must be conneced to the speaker terminal of an amplifier and in the evening I soldered 4 Cu-Be bananas to the cable and gave the whole thing a try. To be sure not to shorten the amp I first I measured the DC resistance first, which was 8 Ohm on one and 17 on the other channel, very strange.


I didn't expect too much but, my dear, I got a fullbodied sound I did not expect from a Stax, clear midrange, quite elegant highs and a strong and well defined bass. The resolution is also quite good, but not outstanding, perpaps because I used the very cheap and very low fidelity SMSL amp to drive the Stax (glad I'm deaf, makes life easy...). Both drivers seem well, because voices recorded in the middle were perfectly centered, despite the different measures of the transormer.

The sound is really astonishing and very musical, I played very different genres and found nothing odd or distracting. But it was only a first function test and I'll go deeper on the weekend. Dans l'après-midi I'll pick up the T1 from the parcel shop but I suspect this will not going to be an easy one for the poor T1!

cheers


Última edição por mannitheear em Sex Nov 30 2018, 10:42, editado 1 vez(es)
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
analog_sa
Membro AAP
analog_sa

Mensagens : 201
Data de inscrição : 04/05/2017
Localização : Cascais

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sex Nov 30 2018, 10:28

mannitheear escreveu:
To be sure not to shorten the amp I first I measured the DC resistance first, which was 8 Ohm on one and 17 on the other channel, very strange.

Measuring the DC resistance of a transformer is generally  pointless. The winding resistance is pretty much zero and what you  are measuring is the resistance of two parallel resistors in series with the transformer primary.

In this case one of the resistors is blown and this is why you measure 17ohm. Hard to say what amount of disbalance this will create in sensitivity between channels, perhaps insignificant. I would definitely repair this and probably use the opportunity to either put in better sounding resistors, or remove them altogether. Most modern amps (excluding Naim) have no issues working in a capacitive load which was not the case in the seventies. Reducing the value of the resistors is probably also beneficial. Just one 2R7/3W per channel is more than enough to keep any amp happy.
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sex Nov 30 2018, 10:47

analog_sa escreveu:

Measuring the DC resistance of a transformer is generally  pointless. The winding resistance is pretty much zero and what you  are measuring is the resistance of two parallel resistors in series with the transformer primary.

In this case one of the resistors is blown and this is why you measure 17ohm. Hard to say what amount of disbalance this will create in sensitivity between channels, perhaps insignificant. I would definitely repair this and probably use the opportunity to either put in better sounding resistors, or remove them altogether. Most modern amps (excluding Naim) have no issues working in a capacitive load which was not the case in the seventies. Reducing the value of the resistors is probably also beneficial. Just one 2R7/3W per channel is more than enough to keep any amp happy.

Great, thanks!!!

Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sex Nov 30 2018, 14:06

mannitheear escreveu:
... I didn't expect too much but, my dear, I got a fullbodied sound I did not expect from a Stax, clear midrange, quite elegant highs and a strong and well defined bass. The resolution is also quite good, but not outstanding, perpaps because I used the very cheap and very low fidelity SMSL amp to drive the Stax ...

My God! you're on Stax now ... briefly you're going to try ortophases and planars, or Ergo Ribbons  Laughing
Stax and all electrostatics with passive transformers are less clear than the active ones. Maybe is what you're apreciating on these ones ... and its not the SMSL fault the lack of resolution, the passive electrostatic are often like that !...

mannitheear escreveu:
... But it was only a first function test and I'll go deeper on the weekend. Dans l'après-midi I'll pick up the T1 from the parcel shop but I suspect this will not going to be an easy one for the poor T1!...

I'll bet on T1, and you're just living the pleasure of novelty ... a great electrodynamic have a puch and body that none electrostatic can have. To drive a Can with the amplifier output its never the best way to get awesome music ... except with speakers!  Laughing

So i put one coin on T1 and bet he wins Twisted Evil

Biz

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
Goansipife
Membro AAP
Goansipife

Mensagens : 2877
Data de inscrição : 04/12/2011
Idade : 59
Localização : Freiria - Torres Vedras

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sex Nov 30 2018, 15:16

Dear Mannitheear,

You must listening all of these and you'll have many weekends of entertainment










Please write a detailed review of each one for us
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sex Nov 30 2018, 17:51

Goansipife escreveu:
Dear Mannitheear,

You must listening all of these and you'll have many weekends of entertainment










Please write a detailed review of each one for us

Hi Goansipife,

there is yet a guy in Germany who already did that and many more:

https://musicalhead.de


But to be honest, the only other headphone I'm interested is this minimalistic beauty:



cheers
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sex Nov 30 2018, 18:02

TD124 escreveu:

My God! you're on Stax now ...
To be clear:I did not search a Stax - he found me!

briefly you're going to try ortophases and planars, or Ergo Ribbons  Laughing
No, I don't thinks so...

Stax and all electrostatics with passive transformers are less clear than the active ones. Maybe is what you're apreciating on these ones
They play simply music....

... and its not the SMSL fault the lack of resolution, the passive electrostatic are often like that !...

I'll bet on T1, and you're just living the pleasure of novelty ... a great electrodynamic have a puch and body that none electrostatic can have.
The SR Lambda has plenty punch and body, more than I ever heard from any other Stax!

To drive a Can with the amplifier output its never the best way to get awesome music ... except with speakers!  Laughing

So i put one coin on T1 and bet he wins Twisted Evil

Biz

The T1 played the first tracks and it made immediately clear that he wants to stay.

Plenty of bass, sometimes almost too much, but not bloated and very deep. Extraordinary resolution and spaciousness. And it has none of the sonic problems I heard with the K812...

But...

Biz!
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sex Nov 30 2018, 22:30

mannitheear escreveu:
... Plenty of bass, sometimes almost too much, but not bloated and very deep. Extraordinary resolution and spaciousness. And it has none of the sonic problems I heard with the K812...

But...

BUT is a word that crystallize all the problems in audio ... please tell me more


_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Dez 01 2018, 10:43

TD124 escreveu:
mannitheear escreveu:
... Plenty of bass, sometimes almost too much, but not bloated and very deep. Extraordinary resolution and spaciousness. And it has none of the sonic problems I heard with the K812...

But...

BUT is a word that crystallize all the problems in audio ... please tell me more


My impression is that the T1 is a terrific headphone with great resolution and bandwidth. Everything sounds organic and integrated. I heard details I never heard before but well integrated. 3-dimensionality is also very good. In the shop demo I heard a certain kind of artificial treble but here at home this is not the case.

Only on some piano recordings the DT 880 offers a certain kind of crystal clarity the T1 doesn't have. But I don't know which one is more faithful because the T1 is more detailed and offers a more nuanced presentation!

cheers
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Dez 01 2018, 11:42

mannitheear escreveu:
... My impression is that the T1 is a terrific headphone with great resolution and bandwidth. Everything sounds organic and integrated. I heard details I never heard before but well integrated. 3-dimensionality is also very good. In the shop demo I heard a certain kind of artificial treble but here at home this is not the case

Hopefully you've eard on the shop with a more expensive setup ... and all that to inherit "a kind of artificial treble"! Indeed its the place to talk about these things, even if its true that high impedance headphones are nightmarish for some CanAmps!!!...

Only on some piano recordings the DT 880 offers a certain kind of crystal clarity the T1 doesn't have. But I don't know which one is more faithful because the T1 is more detailed and offers a more nuanced presentation!

Maybe the question should be putted in another way! Wich of them can go hunting on the other territory when coupled with the ideal setup. It's more difficult to give "crystal clarity" to the T1 or give more "detail and nuanced presentation" to the DT880 ???...

If you can answer to that your problem is solved! Welcome to the simplicity of the audio world   affraid

PS: Make it work under a pillow all night on computer with electronica at full level ... maybe it will help!!!


cheers

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Dez 01 2018, 11:48

mannitheear escreveu:
... But to be honest, the only other headphone I'm interested is this minimalistic beauty:

...

And i ... like a lot this minimalistic Can, i find him superb with is aluminium dress ... like some old Stax!!!



cheers

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Dez 01 2018, 12:08

TD124 escreveu:

Hopefully you've eard on the shop with a more expensive setup ... and all that to inherit "a kind of artificial treble"! Indeed its the place to talk about these things, even if its true that high impedance headphones are nightmarish for some CanAmps!!!...
The small Moon isn't the best amp for T1 I think now. In the shop I liked the impact, smoothness and body of the DT 1990 and the spaciousness and detail with the T1. But here with enFase I have it all (and more...) with the T1!

Only on some piano recordings the DT 880 offers a certain kind of crystal clarity the T1 doesn't have. But I don't know which one is more faithful because the T1 is more detailed and offers a more nuanced presentation!

Maybe the question should be putted in another way! Wich of them can go hunting on the other territory when coupled with the ideal setup. It's more difficult to give "crystal clarity" to the T1 or give more "detail and nuanced presentation" to the DT880 ???...

If you can answer to that your problem is solved! Welcome to the simplicity of the audio world   affraid

PS: Make it work under a pillow all night on computer with electronica at full level ... maybe it will help!!!


cheers

The T1 sounds certainly more grown up and playes totally effortless with great body, bass extension and listening-fatigue free at any volume level. I cannot see how to get this from the DT 880 with another amp.

The reviews of T1 are very mixed and so I didn't expect this (but all who paired with with the Beyerdynamic A2 liked it). It all depends on the amp and enFase delivers the goods!

So   for T1

and

for SR Lambda, too - even passive. As you said, the T1 is clearer and more detailed but in it's way the Stax is very good for recreational listening of all genres without any boring flaws. In my memory the modern active Staxes sound thinner and more etherical. The SR Lambda is more powerful but far from being rough or crude. Really very nice, especially for 60 Euro....

cheers
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Dez 01 2018, 12:22

mannitheear escreveu:
... The T1 sounds certainly more grown up and playes totally effortless with great body, bass extension and listening-fatigue free at any volume level. I cannot see how to get this from the DT 880 with another amp.

When you come i'll make you listening the DT-880 with the minimalistic SE CanAmp Arno ... you get fullbodied sound and cristalline highs ... saying this, i don't really need a T1!!!... just another CanAmp to drive the Fostex TH500RP in good conditions  scratch

The reviews of T1 are very mixed and so I didn't expect this (but all who paired with with the Beyerdynamic A2 liked it). It all depends on the amp and enFase delivers the goods!

Not bad for a cheap french CanAmp ... !!!  dvil

...The SR Lambda is more powerful but far from being rough or crude. Really very nice, especially for 60 Euro....

For 60€ ... a Stax sounds like any other Can!!! Its just a "sound miracle"  2cclzes

lol!

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Sab Dez 01 2018, 15:08

As I wrote, the T1 also has extraordinary high resolution, and more nuances than DT 880.

The crystalline clear piano rendering of the DT880 is not in the treble but in the mids. The T1 has more body and bass so the tone is different.
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Dom Dez 02 2018, 17:49

TD124 escreveu:


... saying this, i don't really need a T1!!!... just another CanAmp to drive the Fostex TH500RP in good conditions[/color]  scratch


Then I would prefer an amp which makes the T1 sound like no headphone but the real thing! bounce
And one which gives the Tannoy the resolution, clarity and detail of Tablette 8! bounce  bounce

Biz!

PS: the Fostex looks indeed very good! I've never heard a can from this brand.
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Seg Dez 03 2018, 17:46

mannitheear escreveu:
... Then I would prefer an amp which makes the T1 sound like no headphone but the real thing! bounce

I'm sure that is possible!!!...  sunny

And one which gives the Tannoy the resolution, clarity and detail of Tablette 8! bounce  bounce ...

Well, if an amplifier is able to give that to the Tannoy's ... then, this amp when coupled with Tablette will surely give them even more clarity and detail ! So, Tannoy's will never sound as a Tablette ... and the opposite is true also !!!  Wink

PS: the Fostex looks indeed very good! I've never heard a can from this brand.

This ones sound a bit warm ... but with class, lots of CLASS !!!  Wink

They need a muscular amp !!!
 

lol!


_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
reirato
Membro AAP
reirato

Mensagens : 3187
Data de inscrição : 08/11/2010
Idade : 74
Localização : Stª Maria de Belém, Lisboa

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Seg Dez 03 2018, 19:54

TD124 escreveu:
mannitheear escreveu:
... Then I would prefer an amp which makes the T1 sound like no headphone but the real thing! bounce

I'm sure that is possible!!!...  sunny

And one which gives the Tannoy the resolution, clarity and detail of Tablette 8! bounce  bounce ...

Well, if an amplifier is able to give that to the Tannoy's ... then, this amp when coupled with Tablette will surely give them even more clarity and detail ! So, Tannoy's will never sound as a Tablette ... and the opposite is true also !!!  Wink

PS: the Fostex looks indeed very good! I've never heard a can from this brand.

This ones sound a bit warm ... but with class, lots of CLASS !!!  Wink

They need a muscular amp !!!
 

lol!


Like a Beyer T2...  
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
http://arato.rocha@gmail.com
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Seg Dez 03 2018, 20:04

reirato escreveu:

Like a Beyer T2...  

A2?
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
reirato
Membro AAP
reirato

Mensagens : 3187
Data de inscrição : 08/11/2010
Idade : 74
Localização : Stª Maria de Belém, Lisboa

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Seg Dez 03 2018, 21:56

mannitheear escreveu:
reirato escreveu:

Like a Beyer T2...  

A2?

Sure!...


My mistake...  

king
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
http://arato.rocha@gmail.com
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Dez 04 2018, 08:34

mannitheear escreveu:
... Do you think of a "universal" canamp or of one which is tailored for one designated headphone?...

Its a very difficult question and maybe even a metaphysical one!... simply cos it suppose that you know perfectly what you want:

If you've already a Can wich you like a lot but with some little defaults (as always) ... a tailored CanAmp may give you exactly what you want and form a very coherent setup!...

But if you have some or many Cans and want to use them with neutrality (without sonic compensation), then an universal CanAmp is able to attack all of them without flaws!...

What i say is valid even for a cartridge plus phono or a all system !!! Its a question of choice...

cheers

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
TD124
Membro AAP
TD124

Mensagens : 4143
Data de inscrição : 07/07/2010
Idade : 53
Localização : França

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Dez 04 2018, 08:41

reirato escreveu:
mannitheear escreveu:
reirato escreveu:

Like a Beyer T2...  

A2?

Sure!...
...

The A2 outputs 100mW/600ohms or 150mW/32ohms ... so its not what i would call a powerfull CanAmp, cos isn't able to drive well many Planar's! But i guess he is tailored for Beyer's, and that's a good thing...

cheers

_________________
Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte, non quand il n'y a plus rien à ajouter mais quand il n'y a plus rien à retrancher... Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
mannitheear
Membro AAP
mannitheear

Mensagens : 950
Data de inscrição : 01/08/2013

MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   Ter Dez 04 2018, 09:06

TD124 escreveu:
reirato escreveu:

A2?

Sure!...
...

The A2 outputs 100mW/600ohms or 150mW/32ohms ... so its not what i would call a powerfull CanAmp, cos isn't able to drive well many Planar's! But i guess he is tailored for Beyer's, and that's a good thing...

cheers

When I read the reviews and posts about the T1 on diverse canamps the tendency was that it has very good definition but a bit lean with exaggerated highs.
But the folks who paired it with an A2 reported a bit different character and got neutral / fullbodied sound and smooth treble.

i don't want to write a review in depth but the pairing with enFase fits perfectly for me and goes a bit in the A2 direction. The bass is natural, articulate and goes very deep, the body is rich and full and the treble airy and smooth. I hear nuances in the music and details I bever heard before like humming of recording equipment, backround noises of the recording venue, breathing of musicians, pedal mechanics of piano and so on, which gives a very natural and human touch to the music. The T1 / enFase allows to listen very deep into the recording mix but in a relaxed way and not "into the face".

Yes it's still not exactly a cheap headphone but the street price is way below the former list price of 1.199 €.

cheers
Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
Conteúdo patrocinado




MensagemAssunto: Re: Tribunal das escutas!   

Voltar ao Topo Ir em baixo
 
Tribunal das escutas!
Voltar ao Topo 
Página 3 de 4Ir à página : Anterior  1, 2, 3, 4  Seguinte

Permissão deste fórum:Você não pode responder aos tópicos neste fórum
Áudio Analógico de Portugal :: Áudio Geral-
Ir para: